I did an experiment 2.5 yrs ago. I decided to capture my every thought. I used index cards. Little stacks of them all over. I work from home. I can do that.
For 3 months I wrote down every thought as it occurred, sometimes 4 or 5 cards at a time. [one thought per card].
I have thousands of cards. Scanned 700 of them then got bored.
I’m aware of thoughts coming and going. Feelings coming and going.
I’m not special but I’m quite aware of the experience of experience. It’s not rocket science, just attentiveness.
What? I explicitly objectified my thoughts. I never said they couldn’t be objectified. But experience described and experience that’s had – are they the same or different? I don’t know.
I must be missing something that you’re implying – and my brain does not process imply / infer type things very well. In short, my mind-reading capabilities don’t work.
I need more from you to understand what you’re inferring.
Oh that. Well consider how experience works: It’s driving a car in reverse.
Something happens. Then we apply what we know about the past and come up with a story. It’s about 400ms afterwards – a long time really and our grammar systems fully kick in.
They can kick in sooner but the n400 point is pretty universal.
There’s a cognitive dissonance with new input. We analogize to existing systems as best we can to resolve it because it’s awkward feeling.
But ultimately, we’re using the further past to describe the most recent past but still past. Always past.
It’s ALWAYS made up ideas in the head
Well I gave my constructive POV.
My experience however is more of inhibition: I have to IGNORE nearly all of the input that’s coming at me.
It’s not so much ‘focusing’ for me… it’s being attentive to the things I can’t ignore.
My ideas are not goal oriented. It’s more “with” than “at” for me.
Only if I let them consume me. They don’t. I work with them. The locusts are my buddies.
The cart and the horse are part of a system – experience is a cooperation between systems.
Yes, I’m a pragmatist. I don’t expect perfect anythings, honestly.
The nature of that input changes the nature of thought. It makes a big difference if you are a computer receiving inputs or a human being or a goldfish.
Oh determine it? Consciousness exists. I’m a pragmatist ultimately. Who is typing here? Me. Who is questioning this stuff? Me. Even if it’s all picked apart and objectified, still won’t make a me, just like identifying parts of a butterfly that’s on a board means you’re REALLY describing a butterfly.
A butterfly has to do butterfly things. Kenneth Udut’s have to do Kenneth Udut things. SO it’s a combination.
I can’t escape first person. I never understood this 3rd person stuff ppl do. I honestly fake it because if I kept speaking subjectively, ppl wouldn’t understand me.
Not for me. I’m doing is as a concession right now because I enjoy the process of communication with other people, especially at the keyboard on the Internet, whose intelligence levels are comparable and I can be long-winded without them running away.
But experientially? There’s no words for my experience… not that would happen fast enough.
Consciousness isn’t spooky to me though. Never was.
I don’t know if our experiences are comparable fully. I just hope I can produce analogies that are comprehensible enough to express the ‘gist’ of my experience.
There’s other things too that play in. Social things. Some can feign agreement. Lie. Fake. How do I know? I don’t. I can just hope.
Now if someone has had a oneness experience similar to what I go through, they usually ‘get me’ in a short time. For others, it takes longer, more words. So, I dunno. Some things are difficult to put logically and rationally in a few words on a forum on the Internet.
I gave oneness as an example. For example, right now, I’m aware of a multitude of things I can describe.
The air touching the spot three inches back from my wrist is a little colder than the air touching my skin two inches back. There’s several hairs on the top 1/3 of my scalp, halfway between the two sides that’s wanting to push opposite the other hairs.
There’s a tickle in my right nostril I have to itch soon. My legs feel cold and warm simultaneously as I sit in the outside air on my porch.
I can describe (just itched the nose, invalidating a portion of the prior paragraph), my wrists touching the keyboard and their weight, and the sensation of the keys as I type.
I can also try to describe my experience of you Chris as I am communicating, what my thoughts are of you as a person, as a communicator, as a debator,and how we’re connected right now through spacetime in a very real tangible, measurable way yet not all of it, as communication is slow between people and takes time for confidence that there is agreement.
I’m aware of my place on the planet, where I am. I wonder how many people are doing any number of things right now. I feel connected to people who I don’t know and don’t see who are experiencing the same experience that I am in an analogous way. You might be one of them, might not be, but they’re there.
I feel dissonance and release. I don’t feel separate from everything that’s around me.
I notice the hairs move as I breath, my breathing rate, I feel the air enter and exhale, and I know what I’m thinking and feeling as it’s happening.
How do I describe that quickly? How do I know that this full experience of connectednes is shared with anybody else?
Ultimately, I don’t. Private minds.
Now by DESCRIBING IT it turned a oneness into a multiplicity that’s incomplete. A skeleton of words without meat.
You can do it wherever you are. Takes practice. I never found being alone in a quiet room meditating as useful as walking around with it.
I did it explicitly once – writing down my every thought – even the background ones – as they were happening. Awesome experiment – I’m still on it really – this is a part of it just with more focus.
Occasionally defocus. Literally – look away from what you’re doing. Be aware of literally where you are on a map on this planet. Feel the gravity under you and such.
Awareness of your presence of body assists awareness of thought processes and emotions as they’re happening.